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America is equally as bad as Russia! /s
It’s worth pointing out that the two opposing countries / nations / city states in this cartoon would have to have similar governments with similar charters, and similar selection processes for their representatives.
It is lunacy to say things like “Obummer was a dictator!” when he was selected twice by people voting, and then peaceably left the office after his two terms completely in line with the Constitution.
Now can you say the same thing about, for instance, Putin?
It’s important to follow the laws of the land, otherwise there is damage to the system. Legal framework, electoral framework, political framework. So when answering your question about Putin, the electoral rules and legalities of Russia’s system must be examined. Were they violated?
That is also a question on the US national agenda for Trump. It is important to consider his case in context of the system. And to compare his real estate dealings to others who deal in real estate. What was the severity and nature of the alleged crime? Are these kinds of behaviors common in the American political class?
More moronic both sides shit?
Class: Say the line, Bart!
Bart: This is whataboutism
It is divide and conquer vs. unite and rule. You don’t rule over people about to go at each other.
Whatever this things reeks of both sideism. Which is another way to feel superior without learning.
Are there disinformation campaigns from the EU targeting the russian population?
If there isn’t, they need to step up their shit.
Not European, but there’s Voice of America: Russian, which was originally headed by Richard Carlson from 1986 to 1991. You might not recognize Dick, but his son Tucker is also a fixture in the media business.
“Hmm here’s a situation I arbitrarily picked out where this message doesn’t apply, therefore the message is useless to all situations. And anyone who says otherwise is supporting the bad guys of my arbitrary situation” - literally all of you
No but englightened centralism means facts don’t matter.
I see this as more anti-nationalism than any kind of centrism.
I didn’t.
Shh don’t try to get them to understand, they need their safety blanket of good vs evil because without feeling like they’re one of the good guys they’ll have to confront their own personal failings.
Say it to my face next time. It is a lot more impressive compared to mindreading.
I’ve said plenty “to your face” and all you see me as is another anonymous with a preset of opinions you’re already set on disagreeing with. You don’t give me the benefit of even having a face. But you expect it from others? Next time you see me , ask something about me and get to know me.
Are you 14?
Looks cowardly when you dont say it directly to someone. No surprise an englightened centralist would use that method.
Takes the slightest bit of courage to study an issue and stand by a value judgement. Takes no courage to claim to be above it.
I bet there are, just a matter of scale and effectiveness.
There’s an organization that sneaks usb drives to North Korea. Full of news, shows, articles etc all hand picked by former NK citizens that defected
But is it disinformation?
Spreading information is not the same as spreading lies.
There’s a great documentary about North Korean expats who were convinced to flee to South Korea based on anti-NK agitprop. Once they arrive in SK, they discover that they’re second class citizens whose only real revenue source is talking shit about NK. This has given birth to one of the most famous NK dissident disinformation agents, Yeomni Park
You seriously believe this? This isn’t a great documentary, it peddles conspiracies theories without attempting to prove any of its claims.
The channel this is posted on is clearly of one opinion and is pushing an agenda.
They are brought to a detention center, for a week, longer if they are showing signs of cult behavior. The video tries really hard to show this to be horrible and makes zero attempts to balance this in anyway. To me this sounds like a deprogramming center but to a tankie it is primed to accept its sinister and therefore will accept it without thinking.
This video actually proves that not everyone can be deprogrammed. Near the end the one of the North Korean’s literally says North Korea is awesome and not a dictatorship because it says so in the constitution. Also, the lack of protesters during the famine are proof that every one believed in the leadership so much that there was no need to protest.
That’s cult mentality. There are people who believe everything they hear and lack critical thinking skills. You might be one of them, but I am not.
To a critical observer this only serves to show how subversive propaganda is and how it can permanently break some people’s minds.
The fact that that exists, shows we have freedoms. Show me the anti-north Korean propaganda that North Koreans can freely access.
Direct Testimonial of trafficked North Korean ex-pats is the proof.
This comment certainly is.
I’m sure it’s not all 100% objective truth. Nobody wants to talk shit about themselves willingly. But yeah just sayin.
You’re so brain rotted you can’t conceive that someone would throw their own country under the bus. Most people in developed societies do, frequently.
Nobody as in world leaders. Not nobody as in individual citizens.
People in the US know things are fucked up, but when was the last time you heard that said in a State of the Union address for example? When it’s on a world stage every country tries to look good.
I mean, a whole heck of a lot of the US is perfectly willing to talk shit about the US. We just get annoyed if people outside the US that aren’t Nordic start talking shit about the US. The Swiss can shut up, or put up. Same for India.
That being said, you’re probably correct that it isn’t objective, as I seriously doubt that they are sending solely documentaries and AP sources.
Edit: Congratulations to The Swiss for their stance on Ukraine.
Make Purple Great Again!
Except that,
Our objective news - is really just a mess of different slants, some being propaganda, that are not censured even when their content approaches slander due to heavy political bias.
Our combating disinformation - is largely unexisting to the point that several large social media providers have abolished or acted against the control they had for doing so and that their CEOs shamelessly meet with presidential candidates with ties to them.
Our glorious leader - is hardly accepted as a glorious leader and the portion of the society that does also tend to have absolutely no qualms about becoming more authoritarian by their own admission.
Our great religion - is criticized within the country and an increasing number of people are becoming atheists.
Our noble populace - Our heroic adventures - Ok, who is writing this meme? Who thinks their society thinks this way? Half the other populace disagrees with the other half, even going so far as to be described as hate, and any mythos of heroic is easily dismissed the moment it becomes convenient to do so not to mention the amount of criticism armed forces get.
This is whataboutism 101. Not all sides are completely black and white, but not all sides are equally grey.
The whole point is that the two nations are the same, but some of the population doesn’t see it that way. Of course our news is filled with propaganda, that’s what this meme is saying. Of course our troops are carrying out the whims of a despot. But blind nationalism paints these as the right and true path.
Funny thing, at least we get to criticize it. They don’t.
nice job writing an essay on completely missing the point
Nice job joining the block list
I don’t think this comic was about you or your country. It’s about how nationalists frame things in their own vs. other countries.
Except that at least nationalists can be criticized in mine, creating such a mess in a first place. In theirs, if not explicit social censorship, there’s clear persecution of the barest opposition.
I feel like the artist at the beginning wanted to make this primarily medieval themed. But then realisied “Oh yeah, news and stuff are a thing.” And then just added laptops and antennas.
It’s been added on to. The original didn’t have the radio towers or “time out” area
The font is slightly different as well
True. It’s very obvious when you look at the “E”.
Someone shared a different version that doesn’t have those newer stuff. That might’ve been the original.
https://lemmy.ca/comment/7948433
via https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/our-blessed-homeland-their-barbarous-wastes
https://twitter.com/tomgauld/status/571994690289061888 is the original
There is a reason the Geneva Convention (and the Hague protocols before it) prohibit assassination. That reason is that the Glorious Leader and the Wicked Despot have more in common with each other than they do with us peons. Don’t anyone get too excited during our “war” (population reduction, economic stimulus package, domestic troubles distraction). Invest in defense contractors, the elite will keep them fed.
Remember the average dude in China, Iran, Russia, etc is no more interested in dying to aggrandize his rich owners than you are.
True, and you also have to remember that many of them have it ingrained in their culture to hate enough to kill gays, other religious people, races, etc.
Despite how much people love to say one culture isn’t better than any other… There absolutely are if you’re looking through a lens of equality. Particularly if you’ve grown up in a more westernized nation where non-perfect progress has been made on those points.
Let’s just hope the west doesn’t continue turning into Yallqaeda and all the lost Fascists suddenly earn a Herman Cain award.
I mean I would rather be caught dead than be purple
PURPLE GOOD YELLOW BAD 😤😤
Typical sense of entitlement from a purple, they’re all the same, that primitive purple brain can’t comprehend other light waves exist.
Nation-states were a bad idea
Alternatives?
I see 2:
full hegemonic domination of one nation state where everyone gets their basics met. Star trek style.
intense local tribalism where you’re doing a whole lot more defending your land than you are now
anarchism, i.e. bottom-up democracy and federal structures. Read up on Rojava for example.
That’s still a nation state
That’s just plain wrong
How is a bottom up democracy with federal features not a government? All governments have borders, unless you’re suggesting* a global system
Edit all governments with borders are effectively nation states.
A government is imo not bottom-up by my definition. There is no formal “citizens of Rojava” , they are just members of their communes. There is no federal police force.
Just looked that up. It’s absolutely suffering from the things I mentioned, including military conflict with their neighbors.
It’s a place with borders, that hopes to set internal law , and maintain itself. That’s a nation state. It is defined as a “federated semi direct democracy” and has a legislature “Syrian democratic council”
That’s a new, embattled nation
I’d go for the second, with pleasure. Better spend my time fighting for hometown than working for a big profit-driven company.
You’d be fighting a whole lot. Think Afghanistan hamlets
Or maybe there’s a dozen alternatives that could work better and both of us are staring at this from the bottom of a pro-hierarchy well that we’ve been stuck in ever since one guy convinced another one he should be in charge.
I don’t have a full solution, I just want us to be flexible enough to figure one (or more) out.
“The international ideal unites the human race”
One guy will always convince another of that. If the other guy disagrees, well, time for sticks and stones.
My point is you either go small, and groups self assemble however you want, but you’ll have many neighbors who might not see it your way.
Or you go big, and everyone’s efforts go to one shared goal, and everyone is a equal “citizen”. Ideally with collective shared goals folks are doing ok.
Or you go medium, which is what we have now. Some groups are positioned and prepared to do good stuff, and others are fighting with and nail just to hold it together. There’s gonna be friction with neighbors, like with “small” but the problem is “mediums” got some real big sticks and stones.
There’s no right answer and I obviously didn’t cover everything. But without groups of some kind, people will get picked off. There’s no period of human history that disagrees with me.
People like you make me sad.
Realists?
Provide a single example of anything aside from what I described, in any period of human history that both:
did not maintain power through economic or just militaristic dominance of their local region
did not experience conflict with their neighbors.
They either had cohesive, hegemonic domination within their borders and geographic separation from rivals, or had challenges with bordering nation states.
I personally hope for a star trek future
Is this like a sound scientific theory that has some relevance to modern times? I could list off a myriad of “this thing has never existed in human history” making current times unique and possibly different when looking at cultural nuances. I get what you’re saying totally, but this is a new era of history with the formation of Alliances like NATO and the EU that has really just started in regards to our span of time. Also, we tend to only hear about the “bloody” years of a society. One war can outshine hundreds or thousands of years with prosperity and peace so the whole doom thing seems like fear mongering.
This and the rabbit/duck flag.
“Shogun” tackles this really well.