While I don’t disagree with you, if you didn’t subscribe to the fact that authoritarians have coopted far left movements to consolidate power, it does look like you are doing a false equivalency to make a “both sides” argument. And “both sides” arguments frequently get downvoted.
I got banned in a hard way from a lot of those sub and not on purpose. A simple comment here or there would set off an attack storm from people who sort all comments by new and look for it.
These people are no different than the militant PETA types.
pretty much. they think anyone who isn’t as delusional as they must be destroyed.
I’m banned from a bunch of random places cuz I made a joke about Jack Ma disappearing for “re-education”. Loud critic of the CCP. Goes missing unexpectedly for a bit. Returns and suddenly sings the praises of the CCP. Definitely not fishy at all and you can’t joke about it.
Oh that guy resurfaced? I assumed he was dead.
Lots of conspiracy theories about him. From what I’ve read he just ended up going on the down low and switched to focusing on being a college professor. Source: https://edition.cnn.com/2023/06/19/tech/jack-ma-teaching-japan-university-of-tokyo-intl-hnk
Totes.
I was banned from socialism on Lemmy.ml the other day.
For providing a detailed post with scientific references demonstrating how the Tibetan language is disappearing (and how the infographic posted was likely propaganda/misinformation).
I had many users respond calling me slurs and none really responding to the body of my post in any way. Then, instead of moderating the bullying, the mod called me a shithead, provided his own references and banned me to prevent me from responding.
The kicker? The references he linked to supported exactly what I was saying! He hadn’t read them.
Also funnily, the mod log states that I infringed “Rule 1”. I checked. Socialism’s rules are still TBD (after 7 years).
welcome to the club.
don’t worry, they will follow you around for awhile, because they have nothing better to do than harass well-intentioned people.
my favorite is when they tell you their sources from state operated media are the truth…
There are instance wide rules. It wasn’t clarified, although it should have been, that it was that.
- No bigotry - including racism, sexism, ableism, homophobia, transphobia, or xenophobia. Code of Conduct.
I’ll let QinShiHuangsShlong point out the problem with your comment
In other words, in all likelihood, waves at the Chinese intelligence system running this thread.
Why do you people always feel the need to add some dehumanising shit like this at the end of your replies.
“Oh you don’t hate China you must be a bot, shill, intelligence officer, brainwashed etc etc.”
You suck.
Also only that one bad comment (calling you a shithead) was made, and not by a moderator. The comments calling you slurs you are talking about do not exist.
I checked that thread, perhaps they mean “liberal” is a slur? /s
Meh, they don’t like to be called tankies so you are already being deregatory. I am also guilty of saying similar things and I am never surprised when I get down voted. Even if you go with campism and campist, which is more accurate, they don’t like that either. Truth hurts I guess.
They are always coming from, “this is all western imperialists propaganda.” First of all, most people know this and every bit of propaganda has some truth to it. When the CIA or some other propaganda machine picks up on what China or Russia is doing and then projects it, it is not always a lie. It is often built on some truth.
This is also true for Russian and Chinese propaganda. Being able to sort what is true and what is conjecture is important to understanding propaganda. ML cannot do this with Western Propaganda, they can only suss out their teams propaganda and they usually do a horrible job at it.
any ml instance is a blight.
the irony that .ml belongs to mali, which has an extreme conservative military junta which criminalised homosexuality.
The lack of context… also were you talking about China by any chance ?
This was the original meme:
It doesn’t appear to be about any socialist country in particular, merely the idea of actually existing socialism. The closest would be Eastern European socialism such as the USSR, as it implies that said country is no longer socialist.
You not posting this in context makes you super untrustworthy in my book.
It’s not hard to suss out the context: https://leminal.space/modlog?userId=17385373
That guy gets banned a lot.
Dictatorship is by nature untrustworthy, so which one do you pick: trustworthiness or dictatorship?
By “trustworthiness” do you mean continuing to try to vote our way into policy which benefits the American people? Because that hasn’t worked in 40+ years.
Yeah I’ll take a “dictatorship” like China if it means we get socialized Healthcare, 25,000 miles of high speed rail, affordable housing and nationalization of corporations who have received billions if not trillions in subsidies. American “democracy” certainly hasn’t delivered on any of that.
Then move to China, because the chances of a dictatorship running your way are next to zero. Dictatorship means no accountability, so once it’s set up, they do as they please no matter what you say.
Then move to China
If I spoke mandarin fluently and had a solid support network of friends and family i would. 🤷♂️
Dictatorship means no accountability, so once it’s set up, they do as they please no matter what you say.
Show me all this accountability here in the United States. A known pedophile is in office and the previous guy in office spent four years giving a huge number of his voters the finger.
You seem to like when the government heavily censors domestic media, the internet, and academic discourse, and actively suppresses political dissent, protests, or criticism of the Chinese Communist Party (CCP). Movement within China is regulated. The justice system in China has a 99% conviction rate…for whichever side supports the side of the state. Mass surveillance with no legal recourse. You wouldn’t even know if you had it good or not. Unless you are fine not knowing I suppose.
From the recent Perceptions of Democracy survey:
China is one of the more comprehensively democratic countries on the list, with some of the fewest glaring weaknesses.
cool… cool…
This data is public, and was gathered by western organizations. You don’t have to make stuff up.
(No idea what they’re trying to say tbh. Is that an edited image or… are they calling you out? Seriously unclear)
PODS is an opinion poll. The way you present it implies that it speaks in any way to the actual systems of government of the country in question, when that’s just straight not what it’s about:
[…] At the same time, more respondents said their country was moving in the wrong direction. The report finds that pessimism is especially pronounced in democracies. France, Germany, Lebanon, Puerto Rico and Nigeria were among the countries where responses on national direction were most negative. China recorded the most positive responses, followed by El Salvador, Kuwait, Algeria and Belarus.
What the infographic you’ve posted actually shows is that Chinese citizens are among the most satisfied with their government, which is for sure something, but is decidedly not the same thing as:
China is one of the more comprehensively democratic countries on the list, with some of the fewest glaring weaknesses.
Thanks for the link, my point was that posting random pictures without context/methodology/sources is not very helpful.
So the questionnaire asks people how positive/negative they perceive the categories in their own country, I’m not really sure that methodology works very well for oppressive countries.
Xi is a de facto dictator. Sham elections and all
You think Linus Torvalds is untrustworthy?
You clearly don’t understand dictatorship.
You’re just missing context.
Impress me: create a context where you want your own rights taken away. 3, 2, 1, Go!: ___________________________.
Linus Torvalds is a BDFL. dictator can have many meanings: https://www.dictionary.com/browse/dictator
Not all different meanings have to do with ‘me having my rights taken away’
Dictator means you get dictated without a say. You become a puppet. Move to North Korea.
I could just as easily say “president is untrustworthy by nature” or “king”, “prime minister”, “dictator”, “state”, “soldier”, “police”, ”judge” etc. Dictatorship doesn’t automatically equal “authoritarian tankie evil communism everyone starves”
Dictatorship by definition means the person or party that dictates. A judge is not authoritarian for providing someone a fair trial regardless of how harsh or fair they are, but they are still dictating a system or an action. So when you hear “dictatorship of the proletariat”, it literally means you and everyone else controls the law. It doesn’t mean you get to decide everything it means that democracy actually involves every single person that participates instead of being “dictated” by money.
Every country expresses authority in some way, wether it’s USA something like Bay of Pigs, UK with their actions in India and Africa, USSR defeating Nazi armies and liberating concentration camps sometimes WITH the us and British. Technically Warsaw ghetto uprising was “authoritarian” and it was a good thing that they expressed authority on the Nazi regime.
Just trying to provide some clarity, a lot of people in the US truly have no idea how evil our government is and what they do overseas to help maintain your lifestyle, and it barely does a good job of maintaining our lifestyle. If anything socialist policies are always provably better at building society, and even the bare minimum in the US are people like Mamdani or Walz that prove even if you enact quasi-leftist policies like healthcare you’re an evil communist who likes dictatorship. You’re falling for it but you don’t have to, if you believe in people like AOC and other “progressive” dems like Ilhan Omar in theory you should be unlearning these things you’ve been taught by the right wing American media.
Dictatorship means there is no accountability. They do as they please no matter what you say. They have zero reason to be trustworthy.
my experience on this app has been way better since I set up an instance block for the tankie triad.
Agreed. I did the same a few years back and have never regretted it. Every once in a while I will see a comment from someone in .ml and feel a bit surprised.
it only blocks you from seeing their content on their instance, not from them coming into other instances and harassing you.
Fork and defederate.
Congrats, you get fascist rightoids then 🤷♂️
Its a CCP propaganda machine.
Normally when people refer to “.ml” they mean the dev instance, lemmy.ml, not lemmigrad.ml.
I’m not commenting on the substance of your post, just pointing out the mismatch.
Grad is definitely worse than ml, but enough people on ml are tankies (including the devs) that it’s easy to group both together.
They are both pretty extreme.
lemmy.ml is just lemmygrad.ml wearing a mask - badly.
“tankie leftist” is a meaningless term and “tankie” is only used as a pejorative against socialists/communists.. It’s ignorant and combative language. I’m completely unsurprised that you are downvoted for that.
.ml
ad hominem.
This is framing the term “tankie” disingenuously if not intentionally. According to the Wikipedia article:
Tankie is a pejorative label generally applied to authoritarian communists, especially those who support or defend acts of repression by such regimes, their allies, or deny the occurrence of the events thereof.
It’s only ‘ignorant and combative’ in the same way that people call right-wing authoritarianism fascism, which is perfectly reasonable if not sympathetically misguided. Not to mention socialism isn’t apart of the meaning at all as you’ve described it.
I also find it funny that your source for the meaning of tankie is from lemmy.ml, as if that isn’t the exact instance this post is criticizing. It would be like if I corrected someone on the meaning of the term “National Socialism” by sourcing Mein Kampf.
especially those who support or defend acts of repression by such regimes, their allies, or deny the occurrence of the events thereof.
Who defines “acts of repression”? Capitalists? Western Imperialists who commit acts of repression daily? It’s not a good faith argument. Many of the “acts of repression” usually listed [by western media, western/capitalist countries] can almost always be debunked or explained with nuance. For example the comment by the other user that “Xi is literal dictator” … I can’t even take this comment seriously.
It’s only ‘ignorant and combative’ in the same way that people call right-wing authoritarianism fascism
It’s ignorant and combative because it hand waves away all successful socialist states (China, Cuba, etc) without any nuance.
Not to mention socialism isn’t apart of the meaning at all as you’ve described it.
Socialism and Communism are one in the in the same according to Marx. As we use the terms today, from actual Socialists, is that Socialism is a beginning, transitory state before full Communism. This is the general agreed upon consensus at a high level. Among non-Socialists or Liberals, Socialism is usually interpreted as a “safer, more desirable, version of Communism”, whatever that means. As such, using the the term “tankie” insults Socialists and Communists alike, as we’re all working towards the same goal.
I also find it funny that your source for the meaning of tankie is from lemmy.ml
Where was I supposed to find a succinct rebuttal to this other than the people against whom the term is used? Wikipedia? Fox News? Where? Talk about bias…
It would be like if I corrected someone on the meaning of the term “Jew” by sourcing Mein Kampf.
False equivalence and you know it.
I can already tell this isn’t a good faith response based on the first paragraph lol, you clearly didn’t read the article nor do you know the history of the term Tankie. Again, Wikipedia:
The term “tankie” was originally used by dissident Marxist–Leninists to describe members of the Communist Party of Great Britain (CPGB) who followed the party line of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union (CPSU).
As you can see (if you care to be sincere here) it’s a pejorative term created by leftists to describe other leftists. Neither are acts of oppression defined by any of the groups you listed in this context. Be serious, please.
It’s ignorant and combative because it hand waves away all successful socialist states (China, Cuba, etc) without any nuance.
Inherently biased counter-point. You can’t just pose a government as having a successful ideology, at that point we might as well say there exists such a thing as utopia. It’s entirely rhetorical and has nothing solid to stand on.
Socialism and Communism are one in the in the same according to Marx. As we use the terms today, from actual Socialists, is that Socialism is a beginning, transitory state before full Communism.
Sure, but hopefully we can agree that contemporary socialists as a whole certainly do not agree on that definition. The ideology is far too diversified at this point for that to be the case. You can’t say “they aren’t socialists then” because again, that’s entirely rhetorical. In that case Protestants aren’t Christians, and Shia Muslims aren’t Islamic. Sure that’s religion, and you can say that’s different, but at the end of the day both religion and politics encompass ideological systems. They cover different niches, but what they fundamentally are stays the same.
This is the general agreed upon consensus at a high level.
This part really gets me. What are we defining as high level? Lemmy.ml mods? Even experts on the matter wouldn’t unanimously agree, they’re not a hivemind.
the term “tankie” insults Socialists and Communists alike, as we’re all working towards the same goal.
See my third point. Generalizations out the wazoo in this statement.
Where was I supposed to find a succinct rebuttal to this other than the people against whom the term is used? Wikipedia? Fox News?
Oh, I dunno… Academic sources would be a good place to start. I wouldn’t say a lemmy community is very close to that.
False equivalence and you know it.
Fair, though I edited it right after from Jew to National Socialism as I realized the error right away. You can’t say that’s a false equivalence, so ha!
I ain’t reading all that. Free Palestine.
Guy who hates communism is getting publicly owned
Tankie is used as pejorative to red maga
MAGA Communists are Strasserites despised by those called “tankies.”
That is not at all how it’s used.
Yes, it is
Your screenshot says “memes@lemmygrad.ml”, not “lemmy.ml”.
