I want to start feeling out future distros for me once the age attestation makes its way into systemd. I am currently using Fedora on two computers, one I use for gaming (all AMD) and one I use for getting work done (thinkpad x13). I am pretty bummed about this because I feel quite settled in with Fedora, but with all the talk of age attestation happening I will be withdrawing my consent from using distros that intend to comply with these laws.
I have targeted three distros, Artix, Void Linux, and endeavorOS. The first two do not use systemd at all and the third has stated they will not implement age attestation methods.
I am thinking endeavorOS might be a good move, I appreciate an out of the box solution. I can and have installed Arch manually several times, but I prefer to spend my time using my computer, not necessarily going into the “rice” rabbit hole. I will probably use a desktop environment like KDE, GNOME, or XFCE.
I guess the point of this post is: anyone who has experience with systemd-free distros like Void or Artix, what are your thoughts using as a general purpose operating system? how is the learning curve coming from systemd? Can someone who is technologically competent but not particularly interested in deep customization (I am a sysadmin, but I just like my shit to work) thrive in this type of environment? I use Fedora because it’s a good mix of being generally unassuming but having sensible defaults and being extraordinarily well supported.
Your thoughts are greatly appreciated. Feel free to give me any thoughts you may have on the subject of age attestation or even suggest distros I might not be aware of.
Thanks for taking the time to share that with me. I am no Zionist. However, I do pose the question, because of Red Hat’s stewardship of Fedora, do you believe that makes Fedora morally compromised? Because Red Hat develops systemd, does that mean all Linux distros that use it are thusly compromised as well? ARPANET, the technology that the modern internet stems from, was developed directly by the US Deprtment of Defense. Can a leftist then morally use the internet? I don’t mean this as a sarcastic strawman but as a genuine question in good faith. I myself don’t have an answer, probably a bit yes and a bit no. I will point out the distinction that while Fedora doesn’t have control of what Red Hat does or does not to, it does have direct control over whether or not to implement these age verification laws in question.
What about a distro like Universal Blue, which is directly downstream of Fedora but not affiliated with it organizationally? Where do we draw the line between consent and simple happenstance? Everything is connected to a Nazi, a Zionist or colonialism if you dig deep enough, we live in capitalist hell-world, it’s the foundation of our very society. Consent is implied an in many cases, unavoidable.
That being said you have given me quite a bit to think about and if anything have solidified my decision to move away from Fedora. I hope you don’t interpret my response as adversarial in any way like others who have responded to my post. Cheers
I’m in the same spot and I don’t have any answers haha. I’m on Fedora too, although I’ve been meaning to switch to another distro for a while now.
I think that there’s a distinction between upstream/downstream, and direct/indirect links between technologies though. The internet comes from military technology, but it’s a really broad system of protocols that itself is a communications technology. I don’t think that it’s possible to moralize the act of connecting to and exchanging data with a server; it’s more relevant what is being connected to and how those connections are being used.
I think you could also make the same argument about Linux, in the sense that many corporations contributing to the kernel (or to packages like systemd) are deeply connected to imperialism and fascism. Is it immoral to use any distro at all?
For me distinction between this line of reasoning and the discussion about Fedora / Red Hat is that Fedora is upstream of RHEL, and users participate in the process of testing and fixing issues with software that’s later used by militaries and corporations. The potential issue with this is that the user is (unknowingly) taking an active role in the production of a commodity used to kill. Even if you never report bugs, share any data, or contribute anything, it feels icky to use the distro (at least for me).
As for the age verification laws, the reality is that larger distros with corporate or non-profit owernship structures will be likely to comply out of obligation, while smaller distros might feel less pressure to comply. It’s the same with the issue of sanctions compliance, where Red Hat and the Linux Foundation had an obligation to restrict contributions from users in sanctioned countries. The issue is almost entirely top-down and in the hands of lobbying corporations like Meta. Legislation like this is made to make it feel like non-compliance means financial ruin, which may be the reality as OSS isn’t exactly profitable. I still think that compliance with it would be wrong, but it’s not like any of these distros directly participated in pushing these bills, and we still have to wait and see what comes of all this so it’s speculation. Either way I’m not super happy about Fedora right now