I’ve wondered what the term was for someone who acts like an incel, but might have had sex at one point or another. I guess it’s “anti-woke”, or whatever they’re calling themselves now.
The actual reason - if you are a person who cares about reasons - is that their opinions amount to ingroup-supremacist reactionary violence. These people reliably mumble that they’re ‘not against’ the barest recognition of ethnic, sexual, or cultural minorities, they’re just against it ‘when it’s forced.’ And then you press them the tiniest bit and find out they’ll call literally any inclusion ‘forced.’
Incel rhetoric didn’t cause mass shootings by accident. It’s the same emotionally-manipulative, grievance-driven, scapegoat-centric, cult-of-machismo bullshit that Eco described in Ur-Fascism, thirty-odd years ago. These people getting mad at video games are cut from that same mold. “Gamergate” in particular has demonstrable immediate ties to right-wing assholes making shit up to rattle a bunch of undersocialized young men into harassing women and minorities off the internet and into hiding.
Sometimes taking what seems like the right stand on an issue can deepen the harm - be careful about getting too extreme.
For example when the whole “gamergate” thing was going on and people were like “Why can’t I just enjoy Tomb Raider?” - one side was standing up for diversity and inclusion by denouncing them as basement-dwelling incels who should self-terminate. So that naturally drove some to those right-wing assholes.
Sometimes it takes a bit of work to change someone’s context so they can get closer to your perspective.
You also cannot say that everyone disagreeing with bad writing is one of the gamergate or right wing bastards.
Most people are just mad about bad writing in favor of “diversity”
Shure there are some assholes that are against diversity itself but they are a loud minority. Most are just against bad writing in favor of “diversity”.
Most are just against bad writing in favor of “diversity”.
But they seem to be so critical of “bad writing” that includes diversity, and seem to never talk about bad writing that doesn’t include diversity. If nothing else, it’s suspicious.
When you ruin a franchise in favor of a female protagonist mary sue people are mad. If you make something new that was shit from the beginning, nobody gives a fuck.
I think Star Wars was destined to be ruined by the time Disney bought it. Hell, people had been saying the franchise was dead since at least episode I…
I mean woke is usually when everything has Female, LGBT or Black characters in it that don’t fit the story at all and or are written to be a walking cliche and or are just obviously there for “diversity”.
Female characters often also have strong woman syndrome, wich means that they are over the top perfect from the start and don’t have character development.
I mean woke is usually when everything has Female, LGBT or Black characters in it that don’t fit the story at all and or are written to be a walking cliche and or are just obviously there for “diversity”.
So, that means almost nothing is woke then? Because I see very few requirements for when something “fits the story”.
There’s a lot of shitty writing though, always has been and always will be, but according to you, when a white guy has crap writing, it’s just crap writing, but when a black woman has crappy writing, it’s woke?
Esg has opened the flood gates for poor writing, we are used to the hero tale where someone comes from a normal to difficult background, theyre thrown into a situation they cant handle and so they must become strong, they in the end do become strong and that is the character ark.
Investment check boxing has made a scene where character arks are avoided, a black woman can’t be viewed as week as the company’s esg score will go down so now there is media depicting only strong character which is highly unrelatable.
I am all for inclusivity but it need to be done right and not for an investment rating, its akin to rainbow flag banners on socials whilst funding a racists campaign.
I think you need to remove the rose-coloured glasses, and look at how much utter crap there used to be 20 years ago. Or 10 years. Or 50 years.
You’re pretty much cherrypicking all the shitty-writing-with-non-white/male-characters, and completely ignoring all the shitty-writing-with-white-male-characters. 90% of everything is crap, but if you cherrypick all the diverse characters that suck, then yeah, you’re going to find a lot of shitty diverse characters.
I didn’t pick anything, there has and will always be shitty writing. But that doesn’t mean I’m okay with it, especially when race, gender, sexuality are used as a vehicle to profit whilst adding little to no substance.
The issue is obvious where we can’t risk having a weak diverse character as it could harm esp rating and in turn profits, so we have a diverse characters that are strong and aren’t relatable.
Look at game like Hellblade Senuas Sacrifice, it wasn’t made to appease the esg system, yet its opened people up to mental health, gender, power struggles. Hands down its amazing story telling.
Not a game but the documentary about Jeffrey Dahmer that was recently aired on netflix was also eye open, then there the old but gold Rosemary’s Baby again great story telling.
I think they are saying most attempts at diversity come from middle aged white guys and just end up being poorly done and so detract from the game/story.
Similar to how 00’s electronic companies just painted it pink to appeal to women or why South Park added Token.
So arguing for more diversity within the companies themselves
I’ve wondered what the term was for someone who acts like an incel, but might have had sex at one point or another. I guess it’s “anti-woke”, or whatever they’re calling themselves now.
The word is fascist.
You can’t call everything faschism just because people have a different opinion…
I wish that was why.
Fuck me sideways, do I wish that was why.
The actual reason - if you are a person who cares about reasons - is that their opinions amount to ingroup-supremacist reactionary violence. These people reliably mumble that they’re ‘not against’ the barest recognition of ethnic, sexual, or cultural minorities, they’re just against it ‘when it’s forced.’ And then you press them the tiniest bit and find out they’ll call literally any inclusion ‘forced.’
Incel rhetoric didn’t cause mass shootings by accident. It’s the same emotionally-manipulative, grievance-driven, scapegoat-centric, cult-of-machismo bullshit that Eco described in Ur-Fascism, thirty-odd years ago. These people getting mad at video games are cut from that same mold. “Gamergate” in particular has demonstrable immediate ties to right-wing assholes making shit up to rattle a bunch of undersocialized young men into harassing women and minorities off the internet and into hiding.
Exceptionally well written explanation. Thanks! :)
Sometimes taking what seems like the right stand on an issue can deepen the harm - be careful about getting too extreme.
For example when the whole “gamergate” thing was going on and people were like “Why can’t I just enjoy Tomb Raider?” - one side was standing up for diversity and inclusion by denouncing them as basement-dwelling incels who should self-terminate. So that naturally drove some to those right-wing assholes.
Sometimes it takes a bit of work to change someone’s context so they can get closer to your perspective.
You can’t reason someone out of an opinion they didn’t reason themselves into.
You also cannot say that everyone disagreeing with bad writing is one of the gamergate or right wing bastards.
Most people are just mad about bad writing in favor of “diversity”
Shure there are some assholes that are against diversity itself but they are a loud minority. Most are just against bad writing in favor of “diversity”.
But they seem to be so critical of “bad writing” that includes diversity, and seem to never talk about bad writing that doesn’t include diversity. If nothing else, it’s suspicious.
When you ruin a franchise in favor of a female protagonist mary sue people are mad. If you make something new that was shit from the beginning, nobody gives a fuck.
(see Starwars…)
Did having a female protagonist ruin Star Wars?
I think Star Wars was destined to be ruined by the time Disney bought it. Hell, people had been saying the franchise was dead since at least episode I…
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It’s “conservative.”
No no, its just “woke”. The only way woke people can get laid is by extortion.
Can you explain what you mean by woke?
I mean woke is usually when everything has Female, LGBT or Black characters in it that don’t fit the story at all and or are written to be a walking cliche and or are just obviously there for “diversity”.
Female characters often also have strong woman syndrome, wich means that they are over the top perfect from the start and don’t have character development.
This counts for all media not just Games.
So, that means almost nothing is woke then? Because I see very few requirements for when something “fits the story”. There’s a lot of shitty writing though, always has been and always will be, but according to you, when a white guy has crap writing, it’s just crap writing, but when a black woman has crappy writing, it’s woke?
Esg has opened the flood gates for poor writing, we are used to the hero tale where someone comes from a normal to difficult background, theyre thrown into a situation they cant handle and so they must become strong, they in the end do become strong and that is the character ark.
Investment check boxing has made a scene where character arks are avoided, a black woman can’t be viewed as week as the company’s esg score will go down so now there is media depicting only strong character which is highly unrelatable.
I am all for inclusivity but it need to be done right and not for an investment rating, its akin to rainbow flag banners on socials whilst funding a racists campaign.
I think you need to remove the rose-coloured glasses, and look at how much utter crap there used to be 20 years ago. Or 10 years. Or 50 years.
You’re pretty much cherrypicking all the shitty-writing-with-non-white/male-characters, and completely ignoring all the shitty-writing-with-white-male-characters. 90% of everything is crap, but if you cherrypick all the diverse characters that suck, then yeah, you’re going to find a lot of shitty diverse characters.
I didn’t pick anything, there has and will always be shitty writing. But that doesn’t mean I’m okay with it, especially when race, gender, sexuality are used as a vehicle to profit whilst adding little to no substance.
The issue is obvious where we can’t risk having a weak diverse character as it could harm esp rating and in turn profits, so we have a diverse characters that are strong and aren’t relatable.
Look at game like Hellblade Senuas Sacrifice, it wasn’t made to appease the esg system, yet its opened people up to mental health, gender, power struggles. Hands down its amazing story telling.
Not a game but the documentary about Jeffrey Dahmer that was recently aired on netflix was also eye open, then there the old but gold Rosemary’s Baby again great story telling.
As if white guys are the default and it’s everyone else who’s different.
No, they aren’t but from a media perspective they tend to be for a large part and somehow are written better than diverse characters.
My theory is that Female, LGBT and black characters are written bad on purpose as rage bait.
“I’m angry at black people so it’s their fault!”
Aaand blocked.
Im literally not at all, i don’t want black characters in shows or games to be clichés on two legs.
(same for Women or LGBT characters)
I think they are saying most attempts at diversity come from middle aged white guys and just end up being poorly done and so detract from the game/story.
Similar to how 00’s electronic companies just painted it pink to appeal to women or why South Park added Token.
So arguing for more diversity within the companies themselves
They’re grasping for excuses to whine about the existence of other people.
Stop giving bigots endless benefit-of-the-doubt.
Exactly but people want to paint me like im the asshole.
Lmao, what?
Being aware of societal issues affecting minority populations is a magnificent way to get laid.
Even South Park parodied it!
It doesn’t seem weird that caring about others can be a very attractive trait in a person.
Thinking this is about access to vaginas is a crystal clear example of the cult of machismo.
Hold on, have to confess to my wife that I’ve been extorting her, wish me luck
lol. This is your brain on the manosphere.
“Could the “woke” fellas be getting laid simply by treating women like human beings rather than objects? No, it’s obviously extortion.”