Appreciate this response and I’m 100% on the same page about what you said. Question for you - was my response to the other commenter argumentative? I was trying to agree with them and expand on the point so if it came off differently I’d actually like to know that!
I agree in terms of teaching moments and having productive discussions about all of this stuff. It can be hard to not let the emotions get in the way sometimes when you’re passionate (perhaps I did in my other comment? Definitely something I’m always working on!). I think that of all discussions, especially online it’s too easy to have arguments rather than discussions and part of that is also recognizing who is worth engaging with and who is really just not going to be receptive no matter how respectfully you communicate. That’s a hard part of these discussions online!
I absolutely agree about the disconnection - that’s all very true to my personal experience and definitely on a wider scale. I work in the disability industry (also studied mental health and the people I work with often have comorbidities in mental health as many with disabilities do).
It’s such a big conversation with so many moving parts; society, culture, financial, government, lived experience that ALL need to be involved in how we move forward if we want to see real change. Part of the struggle, I believe, is that there are a lot of people who may see change as an admittance of being wrong - which sometimes, yes it is. Sometimes it’s been just being wilfully ignorant, sometimes it’s been based on the available research, it’s a sliding scale of errors. That acknowledgement that professionals make errors (not just in individual cases, including research limitations and the wider systemic issues) seems to be a really big barrier I see.
I believe acceptance is important - and complicated. I think of this in terms of lived experience. Briefly, I am autistic and was misdiagnosed for a long time with mental health issues and on the “conveyor belt” of the system for over 20 years. I have definitely held a lot of anger around my experiences that has lessened (not gone, definitely not no anger!) but I think my situation is not unique. There are many people with similar experiences and I believe that it would be both healing for us (and help with the acceptance) and extremely beneficial for professionals in the system for us all to work together. Again, for acknowledgement and to truly be open to how do we change things so future generations are getting the support that they need and the industry of healthcare is adjusting and innovating.
Anyway, it is a huge conversation and I could go on lol. I have not heard of this Soteria Paradigm - I will look that up now, thanks for sharing!
Lastly, I’m not sure about you but I’m not American. I’m Australian. I think this discussion is very much global and nowhere (that I know of!) has mental health, or wider, healthcare “right”. There’s a lot of progress to be made everywhere.
Question for you - was my response to the other commenter argumentative? I was trying to agree with them and expand on the point so if it came off differently I’d actually like to know that!
I just checked. I don’t feel that you were argumentative, no. But even if you were perceivably, I think it’s reasonable and rational to feel big feelings about sensitive subjects like this - especially considering your lived experience. This is personal to you and it matters to you. You care about the truth and you want to clear things up. Even if you were angry writing that, I suggest not blaming yourself. Give yourself a pat on the back for all the progress you’ve made. I see it.
I feel that censoring our feelings is harmful - we have to respect them. I believe for true mental health, we have to elevate and honor our feelings. Numbing, suppressing, or blaming/shaming ourselves for feeling feelings is harming ourselves. Is anger your highest expression? Or is it causing you to hit a wall? I’ve been facing that wall a lot in my life, and I realize now that I was the one erecting the wall. I chose anger and frustration instead of all the things I actually wanted to feel, do, and express.
I think that of all discussions, especially online it’s too easy to have arguments rather than discussions and part of that is also recognizing who is worth engaging with and who is really just not going to be receptive no matter how respectfully you communicate. That’s a hard part of these discussions online!
Yes, I feel this difficulty. I have engaged with people who I believe have used AI to discredit my points and argue in bad faith. I have engaged with people who insult me in every way they can, while skirting rules on civility. It’s exhausting, but I knew what I was walking into each time. I chose to engage with them in debate and challenge their beliefs. My lesson was that you can’t change somebody who isn’t open to change, no matter how sound your argumentation is and how much good faith you have - especially in an impersonal space like the fediverse.
Even if you don’t want to engage directly with a commenter, you can feel free to chime in and respond to their comments when you see misinformation. By not pointing fingers, by not shaming them, by remaining neutral, by keeping it short and simple/condensed as much as possible - we can diffuse the confusion and minimize the effort spent. Passionate emotional exchanges carry charged energy and are hard to parse or engage with, from a bystander’s perspective. If we see a bot, or somebody acting in bad faith openly - in defiance to the rules, it’s likely best to move on if mods refuse to take action and maintain the space’s integrity.
It’s such a big conversation with so many moving parts; society, culture, financial, government, lived experience that ALL need to be involved in how we move forward if we want to see real change. Part of the struggle, I believe, is that there are a lot of people who may see change as an admittance of being wrong - which sometimes, yes it is. Sometimes it’s been just being wilfully ignorant, sometimes it’s been based on the available research, it’s a sliding scale of errors. That acknowledgement that professionals make errors (not just in individual cases, including research limitations and the wider systemic issues) seems to be a really big barrier I see.
💯
I have not heard of this Soteria Paradigm - I will look that up now, thanks for sharing!
It’s awesome stuff.
Lastly, I’m not sure about you but I’m not American. I’m Australian. I think this discussion is very much global and nowhere (that I know of!) has mental health, or wider, healthcare “right”. There’s a lot of progress to be made everywhere.
It definitely is global. There is a lot of progress to be made for sure. Take care and much love to you! Hope to see you around on the fediverse.
(sory this got really long 😅 )
Appreciate this response and I’m 100% on the same page about what you said. Question for you - was my response to the other commenter argumentative? I was trying to agree with them and expand on the point so if it came off differently I’d actually like to know that!
I agree in terms of teaching moments and having productive discussions about all of this stuff. It can be hard to not let the emotions get in the way sometimes when you’re passionate (perhaps I did in my other comment? Definitely something I’m always working on!). I think that of all discussions, especially online it’s too easy to have arguments rather than discussions and part of that is also recognizing who is worth engaging with and who is really just not going to be receptive no matter how respectfully you communicate. That’s a hard part of these discussions online!
I absolutely agree about the disconnection - that’s all very true to my personal experience and definitely on a wider scale. I work in the disability industry (also studied mental health and the people I work with often have comorbidities in mental health as many with disabilities do).
It’s such a big conversation with so many moving parts; society, culture, financial, government, lived experience that ALL need to be involved in how we move forward if we want to see real change. Part of the struggle, I believe, is that there are a lot of people who may see change as an admittance of being wrong - which sometimes, yes it is. Sometimes it’s been just being wilfully ignorant, sometimes it’s been based on the available research, it’s a sliding scale of errors. That acknowledgement that professionals make errors (not just in individual cases, including research limitations and the wider systemic issues) seems to be a really big barrier I see.
I believe acceptance is important - and complicated. I think of this in terms of lived experience. Briefly, I am autistic and was misdiagnosed for a long time with mental health issues and on the “conveyor belt” of the system for over 20 years. I have definitely held a lot of anger around my experiences that has lessened (not gone, definitely not no anger!) but I think my situation is not unique. There are many people with similar experiences and I believe that it would be both healing for us (and help with the acceptance) and extremely beneficial for professionals in the system for us all to work together. Again, for acknowledgement and to truly be open to how do we change things so future generations are getting the support that they need and the industry of healthcare is adjusting and innovating.
Anyway, it is a huge conversation and I could go on lol. I have not heard of this Soteria Paradigm - I will look that up now, thanks for sharing!
Lastly, I’m not sure about you but I’m not American. I’m Australian. I think this discussion is very much global and nowhere (that I know of!) has mental health, or wider, healthcare “right”. There’s a lot of progress to be made everywhere.
I just checked. I don’t feel that you were argumentative, no. But even if you were perceivably, I think it’s reasonable and rational to feel big feelings about sensitive subjects like this - especially considering your lived experience. This is personal to you and it matters to you. You care about the truth and you want to clear things up. Even if you were angry writing that, I suggest not blaming yourself. Give yourself a pat on the back for all the progress you’ve made. I see it.
I feel that censoring our feelings is harmful - we have to respect them. I believe for true mental health, we have to elevate and honor our feelings. Numbing, suppressing, or blaming/shaming ourselves for feeling feelings is harming ourselves. Is anger your highest expression? Or is it causing you to hit a wall? I’ve been facing that wall a lot in my life, and I realize now that I was the one erecting the wall. I chose anger and frustration instead of all the things I actually wanted to feel, do, and express.
Yes, I feel this difficulty. I have engaged with people who I believe have used AI to discredit my points and argue in bad faith. I have engaged with people who insult me in every way they can, while skirting rules on civility. It’s exhausting, but I knew what I was walking into each time. I chose to engage with them in debate and challenge their beliefs. My lesson was that you can’t change somebody who isn’t open to change, no matter how sound your argumentation is and how much good faith you have - especially in an impersonal space like the fediverse.
Even if you don’t want to engage directly with a commenter, you can feel free to chime in and respond to their comments when you see misinformation. By not pointing fingers, by not shaming them, by remaining neutral, by keeping it short and simple/condensed as much as possible - we can diffuse the confusion and minimize the effort spent. Passionate emotional exchanges carry charged energy and are hard to parse or engage with, from a bystander’s perspective. If we see a bot, or somebody acting in bad faith openly - in defiance to the rules, it’s likely best to move on if mods refuse to take action and maintain the space’s integrity.
💯
It’s awesome stuff.
It definitely is global. There is a lot of progress to be made for sure. Take care and much love to you! Hope to see you around on the fediverse.