Groups like Azov have been folded in officially. The Kiev regime upholds Stepan Bandera and uses likeness for propaganda. Nazis infest Ukrainian leadership:
The east supported Yanukovych, and that’s why the far-right Banderites couping him kicked off the war.
If you try to analyze politics in moral framing like “good vs evil,” then you’ll always be caught off guard. The people of Ukraine are largely not representative of the Banderite regime, in fact there are many deserters. There are citizens that uphold the Banderites, but it’s not an overwhelming number like 80-90%. Generally, Marxists tend to critically support the Russian Federation over Kiev due to protecting the people of Donetsk and Luhansk, and because Kiev is being wielded like a hammer against Russia by the west in order to weaken both into opening up their markets for foreign plunder (like in the 90s).
I think we both misunderstand each other, because your previous comment read like “If people dont like it, it has to be Russian propaganda” and I understood it the way that you meant it is not Russian propaganda.
Also I am on mobile and why should I take the time to read that shit? Whenever I see “Ukraine = nazis” its clear To me that its Propaganda shit.
Yeah i am lazy to proof people that they post bullshit online… Relevant xkcd
Not believing and having a discussion about misunderstanding are two different things ;)
Like I already said, you dont get what I am trying to say and I am okay with that, cause english is not my main language and there is no need to discuss with somebody who just use some phrases instead of trying to get on the same page to understand each other.
This one is a good example for a good discussion and showing somebody where they went wrong.
I mean I still can’t believe it, but i cannot deny facts if they are shown of properly.
Consortium News, 2015: The Mess That Nuland MadeAssistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland engineered Ukraine’s regime change without weighing the likely consequences.
Not sus at all that you have all of these articles saved and ready to go for this gish-galop nonsense, but I think you might be cherry picking in order to frame things a certain way given you’re completely ignoring that Ukraine democratically elected a Jewish leader…
Not sus at all that you have all of these articles saved and ready to go for this gish-galop nonsense
Indeed it’s not, it’s just good debate and learning practice to have relevant sources on various subjects saved up. You should consider doing it too, it might help you not look like you have nothing to push back with like now.
I’m still waiting on you to drop the data you think I didn’t pick btw.
Western media and observable reality are now Russian propaganda
Lol its so clear that “Russian propaganda” just means “something i don’t like” to you people.
Gimme one reliable source of the pic above… I never saw any “Ukraine + nazis = friends” shit outside of russian propaganda media.
Politico, the Atlantic Council, BBC, Haaretz, etc are shown.
From davel’s compilation, again:
Groups like Azov have been folded in officially. The Kiev regime upholds Stepan Bandera and uses likeness for propaganda. Nazis infest Ukrainian leadership:
The east supported Yanukovych, and that’s why the far-right Banderites couping him kicked off the war.
Wait so Ukraine is bad too? Is one worse than the other??? What am I meant to think anymore??? Politics makes me feel like a Ping Pong Ball I hate it.
If you try to analyze politics in moral framing like “good vs evil,” then you’ll always be caught off guard. The people of Ukraine are largely not representative of the Banderite regime, in fact there are many deserters. There are citizens that uphold the Banderites, but it’s not an overwhelming number like 80-90%. Generally, Marxists tend to critically support the Russian Federation over Kiev due to protecting the people of Donetsk and Luhansk, and because Kiev is being wielded like a hammer against Russia by the west in order to weaken both into opening up their markets for foreign plunder (like in the 90s).
Gonna check that out later. Thanks for the links and material :)
If you want to find more just use Google advances search for “Ukraine far right” and use a time filter to show results pre 2022
Thank you too mate. thats a good way to help somebody to find his mistakes in his errors / wrong thoughts :)
No problem!
Zoom in the the pic lol. Atlantic Council, politico, freedom house…all totally Russian outlets
Fuckin lazy
I think we both misunderstand each other, because your previous comment read like “If people dont like it, it has to be Russian propaganda” and I understood it the way that you meant it is not Russian propaganda.
Also I am on mobile and why should I take the time to read that shit? Whenever I see “Ukraine = nazis” its clear To me that its Propaganda shit.
Yeah i am lazy to proof people that they post bullshit online… Relevant xkcd
“I don’t want to believe it, therefore its propaganda bullshit”
Jackoff motion
Not believing and having a discussion about misunderstanding are two different things ;)
Like I already said, you dont get what I am trying to say and I am okay with that, cause english is not my main language and there is no need to discuss with somebody who just use some phrases instead of trying to get on the same page to understand each other.
Take this comment for example: https://lemmy.ml/comment/23035625
This one is a good example for a good discussion and showing somebody where they went wrong. I mean I still can’t believe it, but i cannot deny facts if they are shown of properly.
If it’s sources you want then ho boy do I have a bunch for you to check out:
Nazis in Ukraine
Ukraine’s Nazi problem is real, even if Putin’s ‘denazification’ claim isn’t Nazi Symbols on Ukraine’s Front Lines Highlight Thorny Issues of History Commentary: Ukraine’s neo-Nazi problem Torchlight parade in Kyiv honors Nazi-linked nationalist 1000 in Torchlight March in Kiev Honoring Nazi Collaborator Torchlight parade in Kyiv honours Nazi-linked nationalist Trudeau and Zelensky give Ukrainian Nazi war veteran standing ovation in Canadian parliament Canada House speaker apologizes for recognition of veteran who fought for Nazis Ukraine’s far-right children’s camp: ‘I want to bring up a warrior’ Canadian Parliament gives WWII Nazi standing ovation | Al Jazeera Newsfeed [[Archived - Teacher in Kiev “When the break bell rings, the children here speak Russian”]] Hawkish Pundits Downplay Threat of War, Ukraine’s Neofascist Ties Nazi collaborator monuments around the world - The Forward How Nazi Collaborators Are Celebrated in Wartime Ukraine - New Glo
The US-backed Maidan coup and US & Ukraine-supported fascist paramilitary attacks on eastern & southern Ukraine:
Reuters, 2014: Leaked audio reveals embarrassing U.S. exchange on Ukraine, EU
Leaked recording between Nuland and Pyatt: audio | transcript
Counterpunch, 2014: US Imperialism and the Ukraine Coup
BBC, 2014: Ukraine underplays role of far right in conflict Human Rights Watch, 2014: Ukraine: Unguided Rockets Killing Civilians
Consortium News, 2015: The Mess That Nuland Made Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland engineered Ukraine’s regime change without weighing the likely consequences.
The Hill, 2017: The reality of neo-Nazis in Ukraine is far from Kremlin propaganda
The Guardian, 2017: ‘I want to bring up a warrior’: Ukraine’s far-right children’s camp – video
WaPo, 2018: The war in Ukraine is more devastating than you know
Reuters, 2018: Ukraine’s neo-Nazi problem
The Nation, 2019: Neo-Nazis and the Far Right Are On the March in Ukraine
openDemocracy, 2019: Why Ukraine’s new language law will have long-term consequences
Al Jazeera, 2022: Why did Ukraine suspend 11 ‘pro-Russia’ parties?
Jacobin, 2022: A US-Backed, Far Right–Led Revolution in Ukraine Helped Bring Us to the Brink of War
Consortium News, 2023: The West’s Sabotage of Peace in Ukraine
Internationalist 360°, 2022–2024: History of Fascism in Ukraine: Part I, Part II, Part III, Part IV
NYT, 2024: U.N. Court to Rule on Whether Ukraine Committed Genocide
Not sus at all that you have all of these articles saved and ready to go for this gish-galop nonsense, but I think you might be cherry picking in order to frame things a certain way given you’re completely ignoring that Ukraine democratically elected a Jewish leader…
Indeed it’s not, it’s just good debate and learning practice to have relevant sources on various subjects saved up. You should consider doing it too, it might help you not look like you have nothing to push back with like now.
I’m still waiting on you to drop the data you think I didn’t pick btw.