• rottingleaf@lemmy.zip
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    8 months ago

    If your point is …

    You know, of course, that the answer to that “if” is usually “no”, and this is called a strawman argument.

    … then I’m afraid …

    No reason to be afraid! Sing and dance and hug your family, friends and house animals.

    … relatively few historical examples … people sharing tools …

    People have been sharing tools since eating less fortunate breeds of people, the optimal architecture of that is the point of contention.

          • rottingleaf@lemmy.zip
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            8 months ago

            Leaving it open is a valid political position of making efficiency more important than ideology.

            I don’t know which architectures may be invented in the future to work, I’m not against them coming from leftist premises, but I’ve met fewer leftists interested in even imagining them than libertarians or even conservatives.

            When most leftists are too busy with hating on groups of people and thinking about what others own, it’s really hard to talk to them about anything real.

            • Cowbee [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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              8 months ago

              Efficiency is more important than ideology, correct. That’s why I’m a leftist.

              Don’t worry, leftists aren’t hating on groups of people (except fascists), just inefficient and failing systems. It’s the right that hates on groups of people.

              • rottingleaf@lemmy.zip
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                8 months ago

                Leftist ideologies include dogmatic statements. Just like all other ideologies. Otherwise we wouldn’t use the word “ideology” at all.

                If this were true, you’d say that left ideas are the closest to your expectation of what’s best and that’d be fine, and not call yourself leftist. Now it’s as if you are putting ideology above practice.

                Which would be the same as me always feeling as if I were lying while, say, saying that I’m a libertarian or a distributist, because I have no permanent attachment to any ideology, just these seem sane now. So I rarely say that and feel bad when I do.

                Which efficient and not failing systems does your kind of leftists propose?

                • Cowbee [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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                  8 months ago

                  That’s entirely stupid. Ideologies aren’t about dogmatism, but about coherent groups of conclusions based on underlying analysis.

                  It’s pretty telling that you out yourself as a Libertarian though, lmao.

                  I propose worker ownership of the Means of Production.

                  • rottingleaf@lemmy.zip
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                    8 months ago

                    Ideologies aren’t about dogmatism, but about coherent groups of conclusions based on underlying analysis.

                    This sentence translates to choosing a model and then trying to hammer the reality to fit under it. Which is obviously dogmatism.

                    The funniest part is that leftist pseudointellectualism, where there is no actual discussion happening, but a leftist thinks there is because of the tone they use. Also hints at them acting this way in other situations, that is, being used to dogmatism.

                    Without dogmatism people change models like tools, each one for its own job. They don’t call themselves any kind of -ist.

                    It’s pretty telling that you out yourself as a Libertarian though, lmao.

                    Literally the opposite of what I’ve said, lmao. Reading comprehension skills on par with your self-identification.